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 What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?

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Faestus
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PostSubject: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:06 pm

What would you make you get that mod?
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Thu Dec 29, 2011 7:40 pm

Really anything that adds new features...

Maps are cool and all, but if someone can figure out how to add new units, buildings, etc... that'd be pretty slick.

New classes, if that is even possible, would also be fun to check out.

A bit of balancing of the races, etc...

I'm willing to check anything out.

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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Fri Dec 30, 2011 1:19 pm

I just love it when people accidentally describe THE PROTECTORS MOD Smile
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Sun Jan 01, 2012 7:04 am

Patrick, I believe Ahatch would like a word...
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:40 am

He should then register at this forum. Laughing
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PostSubject: Campaigns   Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:28 pm

Maps are fun, but what made WBCIII a great game was the very interactive campaign mode. This isn't something that would be doable by just a few people though if it should be as good... Like a mega-mod that replaces the mode.

I get that this wouldn't be possible without it being open source, right? How big is the WBC modding community?

Thanks a lot,

Julian

(I loved the game since always but never checked the internet for it, until I finished it once again recently after playing modded Baldurs Gate - which has been deeply changed by it's modding community - is there one for WBC?)
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Mon Jan 02, 2012 1:48 pm

I think that's what Patrick is trying to do. He tries to make a WBC1ish like Campaign.

I will focus on adding a Campaign to my mod once I have released the beta.



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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Thu Mar 15, 2012 2:09 am

I think the problem in mods is they try to balance races and are going toward a direction too different than the official WBC game. (But maybe it's because they are mod, not just updates of the main game ?)



Nevertheless, I'm not sure it is so easy to balance correctly 16 races in a strategy game. (And I think, it is really not possible at all. It's only my opinion.)

When I play WBC3 with friends, pleasure is not to compare technics, because we know there is tons of tricks in this game that can make you unfairly over-powerfull.
The aim when playing is to personnalise something in the medieval-fantastic domain, as for example playing with friends as allies against some computers players which take the bad ennemy role... (Or intelligent « Players vs/ Player »)

Once I remeber to take this role, with two players not so experienced. I used some little hack to upgrade just a little the race I used with some others units and army point bypass (I warned them I did it, don't worry), and they was allied against me.
I gave them some difficulties, but I tried not to kill their hero and not defeat their camps.

After a very long war with a lot of strong battle, I make they won.

They will remember this party for their entire life, because for them it was the better party they never did, I was a kind of role game master whose aim was not to win, but to have fun with friends and make them have fun.



The think I'm trying to show is, when you play WBC, you must keep in mind you are not playing Warcraft 3.
Lan parties of WBC are perfects for missions together, and maybe sometimes try to battle against friends with enough open-mind to remember the game isn't ideal for it.

It doesn't matter if you can summon units that never degenerate, we're not in Warcraft 3 in which the food limit is fastly reached. And even with a try to see the strategic point, you cannot really build nothing but towers and only summons deamons to win, it is very easy to kill this beginner kind of technic.

WBC is a game of strong over-powerful heros, they can chose to kill their ennemy quickly and be a real tank, or to be a pure summoner that can raise armies without ressources, only magic.

When we make summoned units with counter before automatic die, we waste the WBC mind.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:14 am

Games were invented for two reasons:
to make you dream
to make your glands kick in adrenaline

wbc failed (towards you) to accomplish the second task in the game you described above. balancing the races will fix that, theoretically.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:46 am

Oh yes, this a good summary to say what I think.

Don't forget according to me it's impossible to balance theese races, we can't really make the difference between a good player who thunk in order to build an efficient strategy and a normal player that just found an unbalanced trick to take advantage. It can be the same thing seen from two differents points of view.

However I distinguish things, it's true we can feel adrenaline sometimes. When we take risks to send our hero protected by only few units to convert mines on the map, or when we try to beat alone several allied NPC players that are not squire, or... All that sort of stuff.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Tue Mar 27, 2012 4:21 am

For sure 16 races can be balanced, is just shitloads of work that nobody will care to do.
If there is something i would like in a mod is to have the old hero creation system back. the new one is terrible to me.

I would work in balancing the 16 races. The problem is that editing the cost of upgrades is beyond my limits.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:17 pm

I think the closest that would be done is just finding as many of the exploits as you can and prevent them somehow. It would be easier to start again from scratch with all the stats to make all of the races as balanced as possible, and even then with 16 races it would be a behemoth of a job to do.

What I would want to see in a mod is as much hero customisation as possible, I love stuff like that Very Happy Maybe re-doing the classes somehow so that they are more distinct from eachother and balanced, even if it means grouping some together into a more general class.

I think there are definitely enough races, and they should be developed more with completely unique units and buildings since in my opinion it seems very odd how some of the races share some units and buildings.

And more terrain tiles would be nice also.

Yeah this all does sound remarkably like the protectors mod. One day I'll have to download it and give it a whirl.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:38 pm

Well, this is not the first time I see somebody want to see more specific race units in the game.

For sure, we can prefer a dark version of the wisp for the Dark Elves, a "wooden" one for Wood Elves, etc...

But I don't know why, I like those shared units which bring "links" between races. It's an old school feeling from WBC1 time when Barbarians was able to train Minotaurs and Minotaurs was able to train Goblin Shamans... Not an offense. ^^
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:55 am

The old feel of WBC...that reminds me, I also want boats back! I wonder why they ultimately cut them from the later games. Yeah the shared units could be used occasionally when the backstory of the races allows it, in my opinion the more unique each race is the better.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Tue Jun 19, 2012 10:47 am

Vanilla Ice Cream wrote:
Well, this is not the first time I see somebody want to see more specific race units in the game.

For sure, we can prefer a dark version of the wisp for the Dark Elves, a "wooden" one for Wood Elves, etc...

But I don't know why, I like those shared units which bring "links" between races. It's an old school feeling from WBC1 time when Barbarians was able to train Minotaurs and Minotaurs was able to train Goblin Shamans... Not an offense. ^^
Barbarians didn't have much in common with Minotaurs, if anything they are enemies.

And Minos don't need Goblins, since they have their own shamans which do pretty much the same things.

As for Wisps, they are neutral, rather than good. If anything, High Elf could use a new wisp.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Wed Jun 20, 2012 11:34 am

Faestus wrote:
Vanilla Ice Cream wrote:
Well, this is not the first time I see somebody want to see more specific race units in the game.

For sure, we can prefer a dark version of the wisp for the Dark Elves, a "wooden" one for Wood Elves, etc...

But I don't know why, I like those shared units which bring "links" between races. It's an old school feeling from WBC1 time when Barbarians was able to train Minotaurs and Minotaurs was able to train Goblin Shamans... Not an offense. ^^
Barbarians didn't have much in common with Minotaurs, if anything they are enemies.

And Minos don't need Goblins, since they have their own shamans which do pretty much the same things.

As for Wisps, they are neutral, rather than good. If anything, High Elf could use a new wisp.

Well I feel that every elf race could use a new kind of wisp, as using the wisps on their own side would eventually cause the wisps to manifest or adapt to the ones that make use of them, as I assume all of the kinds of elves have been doing so for a long time.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Wed Jun 20, 2012 11:52 am

That's a solid argument. You might say that the High Elves and Wood Elves prefer to leave nature unaltered, but you clearly can't say the same about Dark Elves, who manipulate nature in every way they can (since Mordaine). TFH mod does a good job at this, creating the dark wisps with their ability to use corpses.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:33 pm

Zombies and Thralls should also change aspect. The barbarian thrall, who is a worker, and the mino thrall, who is a slave, should look different. As for Plague Zombies, they could be plague bearers. They could detonate and cast Rot. I am going to implement this in my mod as soon as I get the chance. It's a pretty reliable source of damage, since in my mod Rot does damage depending on the levels, and it can't be resisted.


Last edited by Faestus on Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:48 pm

Yes erm... TFH made by Faestus. Thought it was self explanatory, my bad.

Plagued zombies should be green in my opinion. Should be easy to edit the RLEs, but I am not sure about their functionality. Detonating them seems to much imo.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:51 pm

Sorry misread.

Anyway detonating Zombies... It's a little much but it gives them a unique ability, something to be worth unsing in combat, like dark wisps. Alternatively, they could morph back into zombies...

As for the green Zombie, it's already in my mod. There is a functional, but unused pack or .rles of a green zombie.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Thu Jun 21, 2012 3:23 am

Another idea could be a new kind of skeleton. There should be a sort of skeleton minion that you raise from corpses, since using the basic Undead skeleton leaves the question of how they all ended up having the same armor and sword if they're raised from random skeletal remains.

So a new skin and one or two stat changes should be used for the skeletons you raise from dead bodies.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Thu Jun 21, 2012 4:19 am

Alternatively, Undead could create Wights from Graveyards, and use skeletons as summons.
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Thu Jun 21, 2012 4:38 am

making new skins is kind of hard particularly because each 3d artist has its own style which will never fit janeens and co style. Never!
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:28 am

I want to see some serious rebalancing in a mod. Easy-to-win-which-only-have-a-specific-counter tactics are too common. Either that or give the ability to ban stuff. XP heroes are extremely powerful and strong early rushers.

New races would be cool(Like an Samurai-Ninja-style team), but we have enough already. I can't think of any RTS fantasy game that has more unique races than this. Plus it would mean even more rebalancing. Warhammer 40.000: Dawn of War had the same problem. Everyone played the same 2 or 3 races, because they were the only ones that weren't useless.

Regarding skins i think you should:

- Change the Orc Hero, he looks really stupid.
- Race-specific Wisps (As you mentioned)
- Elf basic infantry should look more different (Give Dark Elf swords, High Elf Staffs, and let Wood Elf keep their spears)
- Make more unique dragon-skins. Maybe give orcs a black dragon, and High Elf a golden dragon.
- Make trolls taller and less fat.
- Either change the Minotaur hero, or the Minotaur king. The hero is just a mini-king with a flag.

Also, a DotA-style mod would be cool :).

-Peace 8)
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PostSubject: Re: What would you like to see in a new WBC3 Mod?   Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:17 pm

lol. DotA? That would be pretty sick, but prolly hard to implement.

I like a lot of the idea's floating around. Race specific wisps sounds awesome. Even just slightly different, like rendering the wood elves slightly green, dark elves slightly black, would be an improvement. Taking it further, do the same with the ancient wisps, each racing having a unique one. Maybe even having unique abilities, but that might be too much..

I'm wondering if it would be possible at all to have several basic skeleton models, (5 or 6 maybe) and randomize which ones are summoned? It doesn't sound like too much code work, but I'm not really sure. I know that many different models sounds like a lot of work, but you could take the original model, and paste over a different looking sword or shield, most likely stolen from another unit model (for each frame of the animation, obviously). Maybe give one a bandana.. idk. An army of skeletons that aren't all the same would be orgasmic. And the slight alterations on top of the original skeleton model will keep it looking like the original games art. There's no real 'creation', just copying and pasting of the established wbc art.

I'm not a fan of giving dragons race specific models.. They kind of already have that; each race has 2 dragons available for them to buy. I'm just thinking that dragons aren't race specific, they're a race of their own. I don't see dragons bowing down to any particular race - they do what they damn well please. :p I envision them more as mercenaries, and as such, they keep their own look, rather than change their appearance to fit who they fight for.
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